The MxU Podcast

Brad:
[0:00] We're not allowed to say we're family here.

Spencer:
[0:03] Are they all Christians?

Brad:
[0:05] They're all Christians. Okay, cool.

Spencer:
[0:07] I just think we're really undermining the leadership that is needed on the platform on Sunday. I think excellence gets villainized in the church a lot.

Brad:
[0:14] Whether they're playing bass or drums, in my eyes, you're all worship leaders, man. What I care about more than any music is how are you doing? How's your soul? I would come from the bar on my way to lead worship and sit in that parking lot and look through the doors. It was so bad. I would stop at the gas station on the way here, get more beer, and sit in my truck and just dread having to go in. I get married in 2013, three months later, first DUI. And I wind up in jail that night again.

Dillan:
[0:49] I didn't think I had a problem. Yeah. I didn't think I was struggling with this. Yeah.

Brad:
[0:53] I was leading on an empty well.

Spencer:
[0:59] For those of you joining, we are with Brad, Brad, your last name is Damus? Yeah, Damus. Brad Damus at Shoreline Church in Knoxville. Dylan's here as well. You are the worship pastor, right? Yes. You've been here for how many years now?

Brad:
[1:14] It's been a little over a year and a half.

Spencer:
[1:16] Okay, a little over a year and a half.

Brad:
[1:18] So, more than like a

Spencer:
[1:19] Brand new building. Yeah. So, we'll dive a little bit deeper, but give people just like cliff notes of... Um the church how many people attend church on the weekend how many services

Brad:
[1:35] I think total with kids and everything probably around 2000 okay

Spencer:
[1:40] Gotcha yeah uh and you have two services on sunday

Brad:
[1:43] Two services yeah okay yeah so i oversee production worship okay cool

Spencer:
[1:50] Um you and one full-time production staff yes that's

Brad:
[1:55] It yes and then and then i have we have um there's a a girl named mckenzie she's our student director but she also helps me with worship okay um so she's singing on sundays she helps me i include her in in on the planning um so yeah man here at shoreline we sort of no man is really on an island you know we we sort of pitch in everywhere we can yeah so nice

Dillan:
[2:25] So shoreline's 15 years old.

Brad:
[2:29] Yeah man

Dillan:
[2:30] And you know pastor jason coming in from nashville originally from knoxville nashville back to knoxville this movement that's taking place with the Shoreline Church. For you personally, why do you feel like this is a good spot for you?

Brad:
[2:50] Oh, man. Over the years, we've moved around a lot, but there's a season where- Some

Dillan:
[2:58] Of those moves, too. Have those moves been different churches and ministries?

Brad:
[3:03] Different churches. There was a season where I thought I was done with ministry and started a woodworking company. And during that season, I started attending Shoreline because of my relationship with Jason. I've always looked up to him. And even back then, that was in 2015, there's always been this organic approach to where when you come to church, even from the moment worship started, it just felt different than the other places I'd worked. To where I wasn't analyzing how worship was going, what the lights were doing, what the screens were doing. I could just rest. And that alone, it's always been like that with Shoreline. And I always appreciated being able to just attend church. But, you know, we ended up moving. And so, because of that season when I attended and knowing Jason and knowing Chuck, they are just normal dudes. They're just real. And, you know, when you work at a church, you get hurt, you know? And just having a safe place with Shoreline, I've always held it very high.

Dillan:
[4:32] Can I ask you, you've already shared a little bit of why you've joined Shoreline. What's important to your senior pastor and why is it important that a worship

Dillan:
[4:42] pastor understands that and supports that?

Brad:
[4:45] You know, you hear a lot around here. And I actually, when I was interviewing for this job, I asked him that question and said, it's it's very it sounds very vague but it's jesus over everything and and the you see it's vague until you see how jason leads or you know our our lead team leads um we're going back to what we were talking about before we're not allowed to say we're family here um because we're not. And our, you know, our executive pastor, Corey, I've heard him say a few times, like, we're not, we're not allowed to say that because, you know, I wouldn't fire a family member.

Dillan:
[5:34] I think it's smart.

Brad:
[5:34] And they're very careful with how they lead and they are, they lead by example, man. I've seen Pastor Jason here, you know, Saturday mornings with his boys, picking up trash, setting up chairs. He, he has done that for years. One, because he, he started this church, but he doesn't want to get, he doesn't want his head to become bigger than what really matters. And it's like bringing people to Jesus.

Dillan:
[6:11] Frontline leadership.

Brad:
[6:12] He leads by example. They are so good at seeing you for who you are, your faults, your, you know, what you're good at, what you're not. And not just accepting it, but like leading you through it. Like, Hey, I see this area. Um, I see this area and you, I want you to grow in that. And you know, but like saying it immediately, that's one thing I appreciate about working here. It's like, man, if there's a problem, whether it's me or leadership, they tell you right then. It's not like this secret that you find out six months later in a review it's like no man like i'm in constant uh communication with our executive pastor every week i meet with him um it's normally a phone call but that's what we do on mondays we work out there's

Dillan:
[7:06] Some sort of connection.

Brad:
[7:08] Absolutely man it's like hey for the next three months what are your three goals and you know i'm gonna meet with them tomorrow of making sure we're in it together, right? If I need help, I can, I can ask him for help, but it's like, They just, but they, they're careful with their hires, but when you are on staff, man, they're really good shepherds.

Dillan:
[7:38] That is awesome. I'm also saying that's awesome. That's great. That seems like a really healthy culture. Also putting myself in the listeners.

Spencer:
[7:46] They're like, cool, man. So glad it's awesome for you. Yeah. My pastor's not like that.

Dillan:
[7:51] That is probably already thinking, well, this just must be a really small church. Yeah. Because there's no way our pastor's available to do that. Our pastor's not available to lift chairs and fix the room. And our pastor's got to do this. Our pastor's got to, he takes an eight week sabbatical every summer. So it seems like your pastor's, you know, just lift chairs.

Dillan:
[8:14] And we talked about this earlier. You mentioned, hey, we don't really do numbers around here. So we don't need like 100% accuracy here. But how big do you think your church actually is on an average weekend? Like how many people do you think actually attend here?

Spencer:
[8:24] He said like 2,000.

Brad:
[8:25] Yeah, I think like two to 2,500.

Dillan:
[8:27] So a massive church.

Brad:
[8:29] It's a pretty big i mean yeah

Dillan:
[8:30] It's a massive church that is a massive church our.

Brad:
[8:33] Motto here is like we we run lean and hard yeah um obviously but we we do contract and so

Dillan:
[8:41] Okay yes great segue yes so okay into contractors okay so we know we know that, three people can't pull a weekend off for sure right everyone knows that um, So you creative production, what is the contractor? Again, when I ask for like ratios, I'm not asking for exact stats. Like that's an unrealistic question. But so how many contractors are we looking at on stage versus volunteers? What positions do you volunteer? What positions do you contract? What are non-negotiables? Like we know that we're going to pay this position every weekend. That is a value to us. Break us down your system there.

Brad:
[9:16] So I would say it depends on the player. And sometimes even like what season of life they're in, if there's a need. Some weeks, all of us who are leading are contracted.

Dillan:
[9:32] Like when you say leading, leading worship.

Brad:
[9:33] Yeah. Like actually, yeah.

Dillan:
[9:35] Okay.

Brad:
[9:35] Like the worship leaders. Got it.

Dillan:
[9:36] Got it.

Brad:
[9:37] There's some that are volunteer. And so it might, it might sound weird. Like, how do you choose? Basically it's like, man, how long have they been here? um you know there's some weeks we'll pay the whole band just to bless them out of a support you know it's cool um it just really depends on the person

Spencer:
[9:59] Are they all christians

Brad:
[10:00] They're all christians okay cool

Dillan:
[10:02] That's a good start yeah i like that yeah.

Brad:
[10:06] And that at first i thought you were joking but i've been there and when i lived in nashville it's it's you know and Yeah. That's, that's a hard one.

Spencer:
[10:18] Yeah. That's, that's Dylan and I have gotten eaten alive for that. We've done quite a few podcasts on like, Hey, every, you know, MXU, we die on the hill of training volunteers. So like, obviously the threat to that message that we are so passionate about is church is saying, ah, forget it, man. Like it's too hard to train volunteers. You can't reasonably expect them to do these jobs that we're entrusted with on the platform or the tech booth, just pay people yeah there's a lot of churches that that's just not a reality they can't do that and so we're trying to help those churches and say you don't need to go and fight for all this budget to be able to pull off what these other churches are doing yeah but then all of a sudden the conversation came around like oh we're we're we're not just contracting people we're contracting non-believers and we think this is a great way to reach our non-believer musician friends yeah we're like

Brad:
[11:14] I mean it's

Dillan:
[11:15] I look it's it's more of a uh and or that's it's a.

Brad:
[11:20] Big one what

Dillan:
[11:21] We're seeing is that there's more musicians that are just more talented than the believers in our area yeah and because we have this level of excellence that god calls us to yes yeah yes we have to go find non-believers to put that excellence yes to pull that excellence off well then.

Spencer:
[11:37] We spin it and say man

Dillan:
[11:38] Isn't.

Brad:
[11:41] It so crazy

Spencer:
[11:42] It's been like isn't it so cool how god is is using these people that they don't even know how he's using yeah and like this is my mission yeah and it's like i just think we're really undermining the leadership that is needed on the platform on sunday

Brad:
[11:58] I know jason most on staff have have come from other mega churches and and especially just learned what we don't want in our leadership and i've been leading worship since i was 19 i'm 41 now so there's you know you live you learn uh hopefully from your your mistakes and and the older i get the more um i'm with you guys on that of i've had to have very hard conversations even here with band members of like hey I need you I like I actually need you almost every week mm-hmm because we're low on this position but you can't serve and those are very hard conversations because you get to a point and I have my own story as well but what matters most is whether they're playing bass or drums or In my eyes, you're all worship leaders, man. Like, dude, you're on that stage. What I care about more than any music is how are you doing? How's your soul? I'm a people person first.

Dillan:
[13:17] It sounds like you're a pastor.

Brad:
[13:18] I'm a pastor, man. Yeah. And I wasn't always a pastor. I was a worship leader, musician, and that's-

Dillan:
[13:27] What was important to you the most when you were a worship leader, musician? What was the most important thing to you?

Brad:
[13:33] Myself and how I looked um how the band come on now yeah I mean like yeah I'm still not not like obviously

Dillan:
[13:42] I've got the shirt on button like not visually.

Brad:
[13:46] Yeah I realized the product

Spencer:
[13:47] You know the product like yeah

Brad:
[13:50] Hey man Brad's crushing it over there yeah and that was my life for you Without even realizing it. It was just all about.

Dillan:
[14:00] Your identity was kind of more wrapped up in the platform.

Brad:
[14:03] I wanted to have a name for myself. I wanted to make it whatever that means.

Dillan:
[14:08] And I want to say too, like, I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting to quote unquote, make a name for yourself. Like we have plenty of Christian friends and artists who are crushing the game.

Brad:
[14:22] For sure.

Dillan:
[14:23] Who we know their hearts are pure. Yes. We know they want what's best for the kingdom. They're just not in worship pastor positions at a church. Yeah.

Spencer:
[14:30] There's strengths and weaknesses with these church sizes and the resources available. But like, I totally agree. There's nothing wrong, whether you call it make a name for yourself or whatever. There's nothing wrong with having ambition. For sure. And wanting to pursue excellence. Yes. I think that gets, I think excellence gets villainized in the church a lot.

Brad:
[14:48] And you have this pressure, too, of whether, obviously, I mentioned not, I don't hear, but I've worked at several churches where you have this pressure to perform. Like, Sundays have to be on point. And they have to be on point here, too. I'm not saying they don't. Like, there is excellence. Yeah. But if I need to, I'll put the bass in the track. Yeah. Yeah. You know.

Dillan:
[15:23] Oh, there's a lot of churches that would never have that happen. Oh, yeah.

Brad:
[15:27] Or I will call someone out of town.

Dillan:
[15:31] We talked about worship contractors versus volunteers. Let's talk about production.

Brad:
[15:34] Yeah.

Dillan:
[15:35] Any roles that you guys are like non-negotiable, we pay these positions in production?

Brad:
[15:43] You would be surprised, man. Production is almost 100% volunteer.

Dillan:
[15:49] Yeah.

Brad:
[15:49] We do a lot of training.

Dillan:
[15:50] I'm not surprised.

Brad:
[15:51] Our production guy, Rocky, I've met a lot of guys, especially when I lived in Nashville, but here as well, man, there's just so many talented guys. Um, Rocky is one of those guys, but he's also a people person and that is rare.

Dillan:
[16:12] Very.

Brad:
[16:13] That's his favorite thing about his job is his team and loving them and make sure. So it's like my job for him is trying. I want to get him hired help because he needs it. He will take on the world. He'll be like, no, I got it. I got it. But you know, he's stretched up. He's very stretched thin. So what we've done until we get him that help is help, you know, building teams and training and having volunteers, obviously the volunteer model of like training up and then letting them lead CR or these things that he had to do like youth and all that stuff. And now he doesn't have to. He's got a team he can. But yeah, man, it's hard. It's hard running lean and hard sometimes.

Dillan:
[17:05] Yeah.

Spencer:
[17:05] Hey, I want to take a quick break and tell you about MXU. MXU is the one platform that you need to run your worship and tech ministry. We do it through helping you train your volunteers with thousands of training videos and automated pathways. We help you plan your weekend services with team messaging, task management, and automated scheduling. And then lastly, we help you actually run and execute Sunday with dashboards

Spencer:
[17:27] that connect all the tools that you currently use into one place. If you want to learn more about it you can head to getmxu.com now back to the show i want to transition a little bit you know a big part of this podcast is i find a lot of the folks who listen they're just looking for somebody to relate to yeah because a lot of i don't i know you're pretty well connected with other folks in the community and so on and so forth but i'm finding a lot of leaders worship or tech they're not super well connected yeah and they're like am i the only one struggling with this yeah am i the only one that's been through that

Spencer:
[17:59] I would love, now that people understand a little bit more about Shoreline, I'd love, I wish we were like around a fire pit and it was like evening time because this is more of that type of discussion. But I would love to hear a little bit of your story, like your personal story. Yeah. What just, I want to know what was like Brad in his 20s like? Yeah. What are some of the like, just pivotal milestones, things you've had to walk through as a worship pastor in the seasons of not being a worship pastor coming back in? Yeah. I think I don't know much of that. And I'm really curious. And I'm sure the listener is as well.

Brad:
[18:41] Absolutely. You know, my story is kind of crazy. I've known since I was a little kid. My family's musical. Um parents were singers um grew up in church uh and and i'll get to this is just part of the story but my parents divorced my dad was an executive pastor at a church and him and his best friend started out of college and it was one of the larger churches by the time i you know was born actually in Virginia Beach I'm the youngest and I from a very young age knew I i wanted to do music it was weird saw michael w uh smith like tour video when i was like five years old my mom brought it home and i was like that is what i want to do fast forward um there was a christian school uh part of the church and so that was my whole life i was there every day of the week and all my best friends were there my parents divorced when i was 12 and while your dad

Spencer:
[19:51] Was in ministry full

Brad:
[19:51] Yes well he was the executive pastor and i was going i was in seventh grade at the Christian school. It was my whole life. And it came out a complete surprise for me. You had no idea your marriage was struggling? I had no idea. My mom sat me down one day and told me. When I was 12, it was like my whole world just sort of that I knew was gone. And it goes back to church hurt where these people who are your family, dude, I don't know if I heard from one person. I'm sure I did. But looking back That was the one thing as I got older, just like, I don't think anyone from that church.

Dillan:
[20:32] You don't remember one person that put their arm around you and walked you through that.

Brad:
[20:35] Other than our family friends.

Dillan:
[20:37] But that just, that is to me is like, it hurts my heart to hear that.

Brad:
[20:41] So I, man, we ended up moving to California because my mom got engaged to a guy she worked with who lived out in Los Angeles County. Wow.

Spencer:
[20:53] So it was just. Did your dad stay at the church?

Brad:
[20:55] No. Okay. Yeah.

Spencer:
[20:57] He, so like the moment they got divorced, you guys are gone. Okay.

Brad:
[21:02] So I'm not going to go through all the details, but by the time I got to college, I thought I was fine. I was not fine. I never wanted to work at a church because of, I love the Lord, you know, and I believed in Jesus and had a relationship with them, but, um, I was running. Um, and I was living in LA at the time and I, God got a hold of my heart through a buddy of mine. He got sick and he was in the hospital and he, he was a great dude. And I remember visiting him one day and he was like, Hey man, he was like, I almost, he almost died the night before. And, and he was just like, you know, I just want you to know, like, I don't have my health right now. He was like, but I'm so happy because I have Jesus. And it was like, it just rocked me. And through that event and him suggesting a couple of books to read,

Brad:
[22:07] God, I just knew he was calling me into ministry. So I get to college, did not think it was worship. Even though I had known I was going to do music my whole life, I'm going into ministry. That means you're going to be a youth pastor. You know i get to college thinking i'm going to be a youth pastor and i get involved at a church and i speak to the pastor hey man god's called me into ministry blah blah blah he's like let's go get breakfast and so after breakfast he's like hey meet me at church on sunday for youth so we we get to his office and he he looks at me it's like hey man

Brad:
[22:49] The whole time at breakfast all you talked about was music and your love for music and writing and he was like do you hear that and his his office was like a glorified closet off the sanctuary dude and the youth band was rehearsing he's like dude do you hear that and he opened his door into the sanctuary and i was like yeah he's like how's it sound and i was like it's really bad it's really He was like, I need help with that. It was like this light bulb went off in my head where I don't know why I never thought about worship. But anyway, that's what got me into worship.

Dillan:
[23:30] In that moment, God used that individual to call you into worship.

Brad:
[23:33] Call me into worship.

Dillan:
[23:34] That's crazy.

Brad:
[23:35] Crazy.

Dillan:
[23:36] Similar story. I mean, all of us have similar stories. We just don't think through it. We don't know it that defined.

Brad:
[23:40] You don't, man. And all I knew at that point, and I was very rough around the edges, man. In LA, I was partying and drinking. I was just figuring it out, man. Like- Worship leader. Yeah.

Spencer:
[23:53] It's like- You're like, what do you mean?

Brad:
[23:55] That's what we're worship leader too. We party and we drink.

Dillan:
[23:57] Brad goes, but- Yeah. I don't think about it.

Brad:
[23:59] That's my story, man. I went to Liberty and I'm partying, but I'm studying the Bible. Yeah, sure. So I continue to drink all through college. Never knew it was a problem. I get my first worship job and I'm still drinking you know like

Spencer:
[24:20] You're like 24 at this time

Brad:
[24:22] I'm 24 and I realized man it was a problem in seasons and I think it was just a way to cope with when I was 12 years old and that feeling of you went from having security to none at all yeah and i just didn't i didn't know how to handle everything and it was a real problem for me um throughout my life until I was 31, man, like it just followed me everywhere I went.

Spencer:
[25:09] And, um, how did that have, um, did it have much impact on your ability to carry out ministry? Was it kind of like this hidden thing that you could just kind of,

Brad:
[25:20] Yeah, it was, it was hidden and dude, you know, back growing up in the eighties and nineties, it was like, dude, if you drink you're going to hell right it was like and so the way I'm wired is don't tell me I can't do it it's

Spencer:
[25:37] Like well then I want to know what that's

Brad:
[25:39] Like yeah and my poor dad and mom uh but I will say man like I know for it was like it was a weird thing and I still process it but like i needed god and i was very close to him because it's like lord take it away take it away right and it's this weird thing of like i'm doing something i know i shouldn't be doing because it's a problem i'm not saying drinking is a problem but it was for me because you know I didn't know how to stop but like man I know God used me I'm I've there's been students who have reached out to me over the years that I've led there's been people yeah hey man because of you God called me into ministry it's like I never want to put God in a box and it got really bad um to the point to where i got and uh i mean i'm just gonna be frank yeah i get married in 2013 three months later first dui we lived in nashville hmm And the first two...

Spencer:
[27:01] And you're working in church at this time?

Brad:
[27:02] I was working... Yeah. I was working... Well, it was... We got married and I was like getting ready to move back to Knoxville. Okay. Yep. And so it was like in between. And... Moved back to knoxville went through a horrible church transitioned uh you know it's our first like year of marriage and i was so angry about the situation the way i coped with it as i started drinking even more and it got really bad um i didn't care about anything and my wife literally told me multiple times that she was going to leave me if i don't stop and we got in a huge argument one day we were back in knoxville i was just in the middle of the day at a bar and i was getting ready to go to nashville uh to do a right with some people and i would go back and forth quite a bit and she called me one day she was like i don't want you to

Brad:
[28:06] Go and i was already at the bar drinking and i have a two and a half hour drive we get in this huge argument i was like well forget that i'm going she's like i know what's gonna happen so i go and i wind up in jail that night again bro oh again again for i wasn't driving but i was in my vehicle waiting on a buddy and i had i had drinks you know i wasn't drinking in the car but i was just it was really cold outside i might turn it my truck on heater cop knocks on the door wind up in jail and in that moment dude i was already feeling the weight of this tension with me in that argument earlier that day and i'm like she was right dude and that moment it was like in february of 2016 I'm in Nashville jail again staring at the ceiling and I kid you not God met me I should not have been able to remember anything because I was so drunk. But God met me in that moment and answered prayers. I prayed for 10 years. Take it away, please.

Spencer:
[29:30] Yeah, man.

Dillan:
[29:32] That's awesome. What a story.

Brad:
[29:33] Yeah, dude. And dude, I walked out of that jail. Like...

Brad:
[29:40] Like i knew i'd met with jesus man and it's been i just celebrated 10 years wow bro being sober like we found out three months after that that you know my stories are really long because we moved around a lot but like there was a season after that where god in jail i was like i can't lead worship i'm not healthy enough the only other thing i know how to do is woodworking and so i devoted my life to it and god built our company up to the fact that even we built the sign on the old entrance of shoreline and dude i used to i don't share this publicly but i have to share this for that i know we're probably going long

Spencer:
[30:32] No no this is

Brad:
[30:33] Great okay when i serve and i've told chuck this so i'll say this when I was in college ministry during that really bad season I would come from the bar off North Shore this little pub over there on my way to lead worship and sit in that parking lot and look through the doors and like I I would sit there and I would bring another like it was so bad I would stop at the gas station on the way here, get more beer and sit in my truck and just dread having to go in. I'm like, I'm about to go lead worship. I don't feel drunk, but I'm probably drunk. It was the worst feeling in the world. Staring through the doors. But 10 years later, when I get this job, God just like laid a mind bomb on me. He's like, hey, man.

Brad:
[31:36] Back in 2015, when you're out in your truck, staring through those doors, you were, I knew I was with you then. He was like, and I knew I was going to heal you. I also knew when you started your woodworking company that

Brad:
[32:03] There's a sign. Jeez. I'm so sorry.

Spencer:
[32:07] You're good. No, this is good. You're making Dylan and I cry.

Dillan:
[32:10] It's awesome.

Brad:
[32:12] There's a sign we built that Pastor Jason texted me. It says Jesus's life.

Brad:
[32:26] And I knew like God was just like, man, I saw you then. I wanted you to build that sign. And all these years later, I went, I wanted you to lead this. Wow. And so when you ask me like why shoreline

Brad:
[32:52] Why does it make sense for me that's why it's like in that hard season jason met with me a ton he didn't i never told him about the drinking because but he walked with me through some really hard church transitions, you know, and supported me big time and the woodworking side of things, even calling me to his house just to help, you know, get us started. And so, Man, what God has done in my life the past 10 years, like I lead from a different place than I did when I was drinking. I was leading on an empty well. And it's not like God can't use empty wells, but not as much as he can full wells. And so, yeah, there's no ego in me anymore.

Spencer:
[33:57] Bro i just want to say first thank you for being so transparent because uh i didn't know you were going to share all that i didn't know that and i think like what you just shared i'm gonna go out on a limb and say i think it's very relatable to this community yeah for sure dylan and i have this conversation often i say it flippantly and i shouldn't but sometimes i feel like specifically in the church production community we tend to be kind of like the drunken sailors of the church for

Brad:
[34:25] Sure yeah there's nothing wrong with

Spencer:
[34:28] Alcohol yeah

Brad:
[34:29] In my eyes i don't judge everyone i know drinks for the most not that's a bold statement but a lot of people so like you know i'm not this is my story and for me and my family and just the seeing my wife and how she man she quit drinking after my first dui And wanted me to, and I didn't know how. I would say to encourage, if there's anyone who is struggling with it, try to get help, you know? Um, I just kept it hidden so long. I would even try to hide it from my wife, you know, and lie straight to her face. It's like, you'll do anything, um, to hide something. And I will tell you, it feels so good not having to hide. It's like this, obviously i'm not perfect yeah you know but it when it comes to working at a church or being a pastor now it's like dude how i can relate to almost anyone yeah

Spencer:
[35:42] What was the in that season of just great unhealth like what was the biggest lie that you believed from the enemy that like kept you from wow from wanting to turn

Brad:
[35:53] I didn't have a problem

Spencer:
[35:55] Okay like it just

Dillan:
[35:56] Wasn't you didn't accept the question i was gonna ask did because you you had made a couple references to that point of yeah i didn't think i had a problem yeah i didn't think i was struggling with this yeah.

Brad:
[36:06] Yeah and and that was the one lie of like i'm not doing anything wrong that my buddy isn't doing i don't have a problem and then there was this other lie um and it probably stems from you know my parents divorce and stuff but like there was this all my dreams of music had been crushed it was like everything I tried to do leading up to that point and that I felt like the Lord just designed me to do had failed and so there was this lie of like you're not good enough Hmph.

Brad:
[36:47] You're not good enough. You're a failure. And I didn't know how to handle it, man. At the time, I just wanted to bury, like I have failed. I went to Nashville and chased my dream and it was crushed before me. But in that, God showed me, like I, my whole identity was wrapped up in that, that world. And when I went to woodworking, it was, it, God used woodworking to heal me, to build my confidence back up. And I was so narrow-minded and God used it to open my eyes to just the beauty of being his son, dude.

Brad:
[37:37] Like the grace and the mercy that I've seen from others in my life through my story um you know and now my dad it's like three months after all that i found out i was going to be my wife was pregnant you know it's like thank the lord um but so when it comes to worship

Brad:
[38:02] It's i know it sounds weird it's very little about the music for me anymore. And so it's like, yes, it has to be good. And I want it to be good, but I want my team to first it's like i want them to know i want to be the first one they go to if they need anything i want to know how they're doing um so it's just different man than in my 20s it's like dude i really don't care about most of the things i did when i was 20.

Spencer:
[38:42] Yeah same but yeah absolutely we have this conversation often that that wisdom that just comes with age yeah just the wisdom that comes with experiences like you've just shared yeah that tends to form the way that we lead a ministry and there is no it's not like oh well brad's 41 and he does this with his ministry and he doesn't do lights during this thing and he And so that's the right way. No, but it's having the wisdom to come into a church and go, what do these people need? Yes. And how can I lead these people?

Brad:
[39:16] Yes.

Spencer:
[39:17] And not go based on my preferences and what I like. I, you know, we all look back at our twenties and go, man, I just had so many preferences. Oh, for sure. so many preferences for other people. Yes. And what I hear from you is just this wisdom of like, man, I lead from brokenness. Yes. I lead from humility and understanding like, I get up in the morning, just I want to pastor people through the brokenness and the grace that I've received through my salvation and being able to bring others into that who may be, because we all have hurt whether it's addiction or you know divorce and family we all have our story but the thing we have in common is that pain that we it's like people are we always talk about like the church is It really is like an embassy for believers. It's a place you can come to for healing when you're sick. It's a place you can come to for... Anyway, so it's just so cool to hear you talk about it. It's like, yeah, we could talk shop all day long. Yeah. But does that really matter? Yeah. Not in the grand scheme. Yeah. I know it's going to offend some people listening, but like...

Dillan:
[40:26] If they're offended after listening to that story.

Brad:
[40:30] Dude, I'm still an idiot, you know, for the most... Very rough around the edges, you know.

Dillan:
[40:35] I wish they would have talked about what sound system he had. Yeah, I don't know.

Spencer:
[40:38] Yeah.

Brad:
[40:39] Sorry to disappoint you guys.

Dillan:
[40:41] I mean, the story's cool and all. Yeah.

Spencer:
[40:44] Oh, my goodness. No, I, dude, this has been incredible. It's, like, really ministered to me. I know it's ministered to Dylan. Like, we've gotten pretty real on this podcast, but this is one of the more real ones we've had. Yeah. Um and it like inspires me like man we need to we need to dig more out of people's story because i think yeah what you just shared is it's gonna hit with a lot of people very

Dillan:
[41:09] Life-giving story thank you man like.

Brad:
[41:12] It's it took me a long time to feel comfortable sharing and now it's like why wouldn't i yeah why would i it's too good yeah

Dillan:
[41:26] I'm as you're telling your story i'm sitting here going could i step away from producing yeah and go to a woodworking season yeah my pride automatically kicks in says no.

Spencer:
[41:36] There's no way you're also sitting there going this is how i'm providing for my household yeah if people find out about this like this is kind of game over for me so to get to a place you're like i don't even freaking care anymore yeah don't care i literally i cannot Now I keep living this way.

Dillan:
[41:49] So good.

Brad:
[41:50] You know, there was a season where when I, God was calling us back into ministry, I was just like, I don't know, man. And I remember having a conversation with my wife. And all i cared about it was like if she thinks i'm ready i'm ready because she knows she knows me more than anyone and she will be the first person to say you're not ready yeah so i mean my wife is the hero in this story i'm so thankful for her and just a church who like celebrates the story you know of just believing in me allowing me to be here and i honestly guys like i'm i was painting the picture at the beginning it's like oh you know sounds too good to be true it's like i tell my wife

Brad:
[42:50] Almost every week i can't believe i get to work here it's the first time in my life at a ministry job where i've been here a year and a half and i still pinch myself that that i get to work in an environment like this it's cool it's great It's special. And for the ones who, you know, there's still hope for the ones who maybe don't work at the healthiest churches, you know, so, yeah.

Spencer:
[43:22] So good, bro. Thank you so much. This has been incredible. If you want to learn more about Shoreline, if you want to learn more about MXU, Weekend Ready Playbook, we'll put that in the description below. And then we're coming to Dallas soon. And so if you are a church in Dallas and you want to hang out and do something like this, hit us up. You can hit up our support team or get in the comments of YouTube, whatever. But thanks for joining us on the MXQ podcast. We'll see you next time.